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	<title>Comments on: Lite posting this past week/Contemporary Service</title>
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	<description>West Henrietta, NY</description>
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		<title>By: Parson Brown</title>
		<link>http://www.saintmarkslutheran.org/2008/11/16/lite-posting-this-past-weekcontemporary-service/comment-page-1/#comment-636</link>
		<dc:creator>Parson Brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 May 2009 12:57:51 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Your dichotomy gets to the very core of the issue.  Is worship for believers or is it for seekers (let&#039;s leave out the discussion of if there is such a thing)?  If you are going to answer for believers alone, that does not relieve the church of the burden of the Matt 28 and go to all nations.  If you are going to answer for believers alone, the burden on the church itself increases as it must use other places/events/time for evangelism.  If you answer for believers and ignore evangelism, we are being unfaithful and turning inward.  We serve ourselves and not others.  If you don&#039;t mind I&#039;m going to pull this to the main page later today and expand a little.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your dichotomy gets to the very core of the issue.  Is worship for believers or is it for seekers (let&#8217;s leave out the discussion of if there is such a thing)?  If you are going to answer for believers alone, that does not relieve the church of the burden of the Matt 28 and go to all nations.  If you are going to answer for believers alone, the burden on the church itself increases as it must use other places/events/time for evangelism.  If you answer for believers and ignore evangelism, we are being unfaithful and turning inward.  We serve ourselves and not others.  If you don&#8217;t mind I&#8217;m going to pull this to the main page later today and expand a little.</p>
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		<title>By: Classic protestant who loves orthodoxy</title>
		<link>http://www.saintmarkslutheran.org/2008/11/16/lite-posting-this-past-weekcontemporary-service/comment-page-1/#comment-635</link>
		<dc:creator>Classic protestant who loves orthodoxy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 23:52:26 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>So,,,is the purpose of worship for the people of God to assemble corporately  to hear the gospel preached, confess our sins and partake of the sacraments?  Or is evangelism the purpose of worship?  To the former I say yes and the latter, no.  Worship began its wobble when churches began to feel the need to cater to the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So,,,is the purpose of worship for the people of God to assemble corporately  to hear the gospel preached, confess our sins and partake of the sacraments?  Or is evangelism the purpose of worship?  To the former I say yes and the latter, no.  Worship began its wobble when churches began to feel the need to cater to the world.</p>
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		<title>By: Parson Brown</title>
		<link>http://www.saintmarkslutheran.org/2008/11/16/lite-posting-this-past-weekcontemporary-service/comment-page-1/#comment-634</link>
		<dc:creator>Parson Brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 12:58:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintmarkslutheran.org/?p=483#comment-634</guid>
		<description>Thank you for the comment.  You have some great points that we definitely feel the tension of.  The post that this comment is on was refering to an experiment done in November and repeated in January.  The request from some parishoners is phrased &quot;contemporary worship&quot;.  The good Lutheran question is - &quot;what does that mean?&quot;  Our little workgroup started to answer that and some of the answers might have been surprising and some not so surprising.  The net of those was more of a request for modern language and pace in the hymns/music employed, but it did not extend to &quot;worship band&quot; style contemporary.  We held exactly that conversation between the emotionalism based service and a service grounded in the Lutheran liturgical tradition.  Even out of the &quot;contemporary group&quot; your heart would be warmed by the appreciation of orderly service.  The main point was the music.

Right now what the form that contemprory has taken is a once a month service where we attempt to source all hymns from 1980 and later (which is not exactly contemporary, but for the church positively rebellious), but it is placed within an orderly litugical framework.  That is actually a pretty tough task sorting out suitable songs that a congregation can actually sing.  The other part of this tension is that we as the church are called to engage with the culture we are place in.  In that sense we are always exiles in this world.  Have we the modern church failed to give space to the creative people in our midst.  Those creative people often define the culture that we live in.  When was the last time that a congregation we were a part of sang a hymn composed by a member?  Essentially when people say contemporary I&#039;ve always taken that to mean a cultural expression that they can relate too.  The church stopped setting the larger cultural expression somewhere in the 20th century.  Relevance definitely isn&#039;t everything, especially at the expense of the Word, but the challenge for the church in every generation is to engage the World with the Word in a way that some might hear - a creative tension.  Getting very long.  I might turn this into a longer post/thread is Ethan goes along, but thanks for the good comment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for the comment.  You have some great points that we definitely feel the tension of.  The post that this comment is on was refering to an experiment done in November and repeated in January.  The request from some parishoners is phrased &#8220;contemporary worship&#8221;.  The good Lutheran question is &#8211; &#8220;what does that mean?&#8221;  Our little workgroup started to answer that and some of the answers might have been surprising and some not so surprising.  The net of those was more of a request for modern language and pace in the hymns/music employed, but it did not extend to &#8220;worship band&#8221; style contemporary.  We held exactly that conversation between the emotionalism based service and a service grounded in the Lutheran liturgical tradition.  Even out of the &#8220;contemporary group&#8221; your heart would be warmed by the appreciation of orderly service.  The main point was the music.</p>
<p>Right now what the form that contemprory has taken is a once a month service where we attempt to source all hymns from 1980 and later (which is not exactly contemporary, but for the church positively rebellious), but it is placed within an orderly litugical framework.  That is actually a pretty tough task sorting out suitable songs that a congregation can actually sing.  The other part of this tension is that we as the church are called to engage with the culture we are place in.  In that sense we are always exiles in this world.  Have we the modern church failed to give space to the creative people in our midst.  Those creative people often define the culture that we live in.  When was the last time that a congregation we were a part of sang a hymn composed by a member?  Essentially when people say contemporary I&#8217;ve always taken that to mean a cultural expression that they can relate too.  The church stopped setting the larger cultural expression somewhere in the 20th century.  Relevance definitely isn&#8217;t everything, especially at the expense of the Word, but the challenge for the church in every generation is to engage the World with the Word in a way that some might hear &#8211; a creative tension.  Getting very long.  I might turn this into a longer post/thread is Ethan goes along, but thanks for the good comment.</p>
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		<title>By: Classic protestant who loves orthodoxy</title>
		<link>http://www.saintmarkslutheran.org/2008/11/16/lite-posting-this-past-weekcontemporary-service/comment-page-1/#comment-632</link>
		<dc:creator>Classic protestant who loves orthodoxy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 22:08:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintmarkslutheran.org/?p=483#comment-632</guid>
		<description>We are not members of St. Mark&#039;s but are looking at that as being a possibility.  However, finding they are yet another church experimenting with contemporary worship, we are not sure.  We are looking for dignified, intelligent, orthodox worship where worship is not confused with emotionalism.    How does God want to be worshiped?  His standards of worship can be seen throughout scripture and in Hebrews He had the words penned, &quot;...with awe and reverence&quot;  for our God is a consuming fire.    Is it really about old verses new or is is really about church verses the world?  Is worship about us or about God?  Could there be a reason we see no examples of musical instruments used for worship in the New Testament, only in the Old where they were done away along with  the ceremonial law and the temple?  At least that would fix the worship wars!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We are not members of St. Mark&#8217;s but are looking at that as being a possibility.  However, finding they are yet another church experimenting with contemporary worship, we are not sure.  We are looking for dignified, intelligent, orthodox worship where worship is not confused with emotionalism.    How does God want to be worshiped?  His standards of worship can be seen throughout scripture and in Hebrews He had the words penned, &#8220;&#8230;with awe and reverence&#8221;  for our God is a consuming fire.    Is it really about old verses new or is is really about church verses the world?  Is worship about us or about God?  Could there be a reason we see no examples of musical instruments used for worship in the New Testament, only in the Old where they were done away along with  the ceremonial law and the temple?  At least that would fix the worship wars!</p>
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		<title>By: Loretta Engelhardt</title>
		<link>http://www.saintmarkslutheran.org/2008/11/16/lite-posting-this-past-weekcontemporary-service/comment-page-1/#comment-445</link>
		<dc:creator>Loretta Engelhardt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 22:07:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintmarkslutheran.org/?p=483#comment-445</guid>
		<description>I attended the November contemporary service-I thought it was very spiritually uplifting, especially the communion service.  Some of the more modern songs will take time for the congregation to become familiar with, but I have contemporary Chrisitian music CD&#039;s, which I play when I am driving in my car, &amp; I find them full of praise &amp; a feeling of worship!!  I have attended various contemporary services, both Lutheran &amp; non-Lutheran &amp; have truly enjoyed them &amp; I am certainly not a young person!!  I believe this is the way other churches are reaching church-seekers who are searching for relavent meaning of the Gospel message to their everyday lives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I attended the November contemporary service-I thought it was very spiritually uplifting, especially the communion service.  Some of the more modern songs will take time for the congregation to become familiar with, but I have contemporary Chrisitian music CD&#8217;s, which I play when I am driving in my car, &amp; I find them full of praise &amp; a feeling of worship!!  I have attended various contemporary services, both Lutheran &amp; non-Lutheran &amp; have truly enjoyed them &amp; I am certainly not a young person!!  I believe this is the way other churches are reaching church-seekers who are searching for relavent meaning of the Gospel message to their everyday lives.</p>
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